Author Topic: Transponders  (Read 1814 times)

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Offline Tim Kingham

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #15 on: May 28, 2019, 07:43:30 am »
I did not make the suggestion about transponders  to replace marshals( or rather observers ) but just to reduce the administration load.
As someone who has running battles with Banks and the ACU who think they can use mobile technology to authenticate who I am when I cant get a mobile signal at my home I am well aware of the limitations of the UK mobile network (we are not in south Korea) but a transponder system would be locally autonomous. I also think it would be (should be?) a long time before we should use electronic route books I have used a Lucas dynamo for lights on my bikes on a trial before and marginal is the word that comes to mind....  quickly followed by the two comments  "route changes" and "the best laid plans......."

Offline David (tufty) White

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #16 on: May 28, 2019, 03:37:16 pm »
I’d like to think that when the club was founded they embraced the latest technology whether that be competition machines or the ways of navigation and event control.

We seem to have an issue with the “we’ve always done it that way” brigade, which is why the club is slowly dying on its arse.

People in this thread are merely looking at alternatives or improvements. It’s just an investigation at the moment looking at the possibilities.

Please can we be a bit more positive about the investigation and seeing what we can do instead of saying ‘it’s all too expensive and we’ve never done it like that’.

If you always do what you’ve always done you’ll always get what you’ve always got. Which is a diminishing membership.

Offline Paul Wheatley

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #17 on: May 28, 2019, 05:50:31 pm »
I’d like to think that when the club was founded they embraced the latest technology whether that be competition machines or the ways of navigation and event control.

We seem to have an issue with the “we’ve always done it that way” brigade, which is why the club is slowly dying on its arse.

People in this thread are merely looking at alternatives or improvements. It’s just an investigation at the moment looking at the possibilities.

Please can we be a bit more positive about the investigation and seeing what we can do instead of saying ‘it’s all too expensive and we’ve never done it like that’.

If you always do what you’ve always done you’ll always get what you’ve always got. Which is a diminishing membership.

I think that was squarely aimed at me, so kindly understand my point of view:

I'm a member of the club and have been for getting on for twenty years. I don't compete (although I did up to about fifteen years ago), but I do still spend money, time and effort supporting as a marshal/observer. I travelled overnight to help with the Land's End this Easter and had to take a day off work in order to do so.. I have done this for some years and it costs me almost as much to do that as it does for club members to compete. I also ran the Carsington Time Control for the Edinburgh the year before. As I had just had eye surgery I had to persuade someone else to drive me to and from.

If the price of membership is increased by an unreasonable margin to pay for technology that I think we could actually do without, I will probably soon be among the diminishing numbers.

Until then I'll keep my pencil and waterproof paper at the ready.
PW.

Offline Jason Potts

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #18 on: May 28, 2019, 07:17:56 pm »
Hey Paul, if it wasn't for people like you this club wouldn't exist. You must not forget that.

Your opinion is always welcome. I'm also a big fan of low tech as low tech is usually pretty solid and reliable.

But the club also has to investigate alternatives as technology moves on. and as Ian has pointed out, If other clubs are using this new tech in their events and it looks like this could benifit us, then i think we would be daft not to have a cursory look at using it.

Having said that I'm pretty sure it will have to prove to be very beneficial before the club spends its money and takes it up. It will require real evidence and not just our mad ramblings.

Also I'm not biting at the project manager bait ian.  ;D

Offline Tim Kingham

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #19 on: May 28, 2019, 08:34:48 pm »
This was the bunch that covered our team in last years classic motorcycle  endurance race at Donnington we were in the pits and followed it all on the internet perhaps too far too soon but the basic system as used in marathons seems a simple step. No easily available prices but we can only ask...
https://www.mylaps.com/systems/prochip-system/

Offline Paul Wheatley

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #20 on: May 29, 2019, 06:53:56 am »
I'm also a big fan of low tech as low tech is usually pretty solid and reliable.
But the club also has to investigate alternatives as technology moves on. and as Ian has pointed out, If other clubs are using this new tech in their events and it looks like this could benifit us, then i think we would be daft not to have a cursory look at using it.
Having said that I'm pretty sure it will have to prove to be very beneficial before the club spends its money and takes it up. It will require real evidence and not just our mad ramblings.

Jason, I totally agree. However, as I said earlier, I work in a world which includes the use of fairly high tech and very expensive equipment, these days run by digital electronics and I have no choice but to fully embrace change. From over forty years of experience and having seen the changes I've become aware that if high tech electronic stuff goes wrong (and it does!), it can be a lot more inconvenient than "old tech", more difficult and far more expensive to sort out.  :o

In any case, we would still need some way of marking the actual performance of competitors on sections. It's not just a case of logging each vehicle as it passes the section end boards.

An electronic "clocking in/clocking out" system would certainly help at the halts, though. Having run a time control and helped on other occasions I know it's not easy to keep track of who's done what and some competitors were a bit "troublesome" to deal with, shall we say...
PW.

Offline Stephen Bailey

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #21 on: May 29, 2019, 10:13:26 am »
Don't we normally throw the time sheet out after one or two hold ups on almost every trial anyway?

And I am not sure that lack of transponders is even one of the reasons that membership is decreasing.


Offline Simon Woodall

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2019, 10:55:17 am »
Quote
I’d like to think that when the club was founded they embraced the latest technology
They certainly did, they created a club for forward thinkers who thought the future of cycling might be improved by stuffing an engine onto a bicycle.
That's why we are The Motor Cycling Club, NOT The Motorcycling Club.   The word motorcycle did not exist when the club was formed.

Offline Mark Gregg

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #23 on: May 29, 2019, 08:53:58 pm »
i watched something on discovery channel over the weekend that claimed messers harley and davidson were the first to use the term motor cycle, Probably reflects more on how i spend my weekend than historical accuracy. :)

Offline Jonathan Laver

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Re: Transponders
« Reply #24 on: May 30, 2019, 06:28:48 pm »
Electronic technology is moving quicker than ever. As new innovations and improvements come to the market, the asking price of yesterday’s products drop rapidly. There are several methods of electronically recording who was at a particular place and at what time. The recordings can then be combining with off the peg software to present a record against a timeline. What value to our type of events ?   The onus could now be put upon the competitor to depart, route checks and finish using the system. Gone would be the ques for control cards and timing marshals. The results team would also see at a glance any competitor who ran out of time sequence relative to the rest of the field. Also it would identify anyone who did not clock in at a route check. I think we ought to be aware of what is available and how it could be used to help within our events. In this example we might be only talking about a few marshal posts saved but the limited number could then be better used.
As a cautionary note – the MCC did use WW2 field telephones to communicate upon some sections. The ones with the handle upon the side to generate power to ring a bell at the other end. These worked !  Ten years ago I had a request for a replacement set of phones from one section – answer came there none !
Jonathan L.